Selling Your eCommerce Business

Hosted By Andrew Morgans


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Matt Edmundson

Today's Guest: Matt Edmundson

CEO - Aurion Digital

Ep. #805 - Selling Your eCommerce Business

In this episode of Startup Hustle, Andrew Morgans talks with Matt Edmundson, CEO of Aurion Digital, about selling your eCommerce business and everything that comes with it.

Covered In This Episode

Selling your eCommerce business is not simple as you think. It can take months of negotiations, headaches, and sleepless nights. So, what should founders and entrepreneurs keep in mind when planning to exit their businesses?

Andrew interviews eCommerce expert Matt Edmundson about his experiences exiting his eCommerce businesses. Matt shares what he believes every founder should prepare when selling their eCommerce business. They also discuss the emotional cost of selling a business and why it is very important to end it well.

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  • Founder’s background (2:05)
  • Learning about business from importing saunas and steam rooms (12:46)
  • Running a web-building agency and a health spa business (18:52)
  • Jersey Beauty Company (22:55)
  • Coaching eCommerce and traveling the world (28:31)
  • Learning through coaching (31:27)
  • Exiting your business (39:29)
  • What to prepare when exiting a business (53:43)
  • Don’t burn bridges (55:33)
  • Wrapping up (1:02:11)

Key Quotes

If you tell people what you’re really thinking and not afraid to ask questions, and like, you know, get into it. It’s amazing what that insight can do for people who just want to shoot straight. And I think in the business world, people are so scared of being wrong with the advice they’re giving that they’re, you know, they don’t do anything at all.

Andrew Morgans

Whenever you’re coming to exit, whenever you’re going to end something, end it well. So your relationship with your customers; end that well. your relationship with your staff, end it well. Your relationship with your suppliers. Don’t burn bridges.

Matt Edmundson

You can understand it from the buyer’s point of view. They want to know what they’re buying, you know, it’s a lot, it’s a chunk of change that they put in with, so they want to know there’s longevity in it for them and that they can make this thing work. So it’s quite right that they do this due diligence, but due diligence is not a pleasant process.

Matt Edmundson

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Rough Transcript

Following is an auto-generated text transcript of this episode. Apologies for any errors!

Andrew Morgans 0:01
What’s up, Hustlers? Welcome back. This is Andrew Morgan, your host for today’s episode is Startup Hustle, covering all things eCommerce, and Amazon entrepreneurship. I’m super excited about today’s guests. I say that every week, but that’s because I actually am I get some amazing guests on this show. And I’m just privileged to get the chance to pick their brains for 45 minutes and share some of that with you. So, founder Marknology here with you today. We’re gonna get into some awesome stuff before we do. Today’s episode of Startup Hustle is sponsored by Gusto has monitored solutions for modern HR problems, whether it’s talent management, payroll, or onboarding tools, use those HR platform has it all for you be smarter than your competitors, try a three-month free subscription now, just sign up at backslash Startup Hustle to get started. That’s backslash Startup Hustle. super thankful for our sponsors. They’re there, what fund us being able to promote this show and get it out to more viewers. And I personally am a user of Gousto. So I love when our sponsors are also something that I’m using in my day to day. But today’s episode is called selling your E-commerce business. And a lot of our listeners know that right now, it’s a super hot time with aggregators. Of course, a lot of business builders are in it from the beginning to exit, that’s part of their plan. And even if it’s not part of your plan, it should be at some point. So a lot of stuff around this that I think will be a lot of fun. Today’s guest has sold his own business now runs a consulting agency. And some I won’t go into all of that has his own podcast, several brands he’s working with. So he has a lot of expertise around this space. Coming all the way from England. Matt Edmondson, welcome to the show.

Matt Edmundson 1:43
Well, thank you for that intro. It’s great to be here. All the way from England to Yeah, absolutely.

Andrew Morgans 1:49
Well, I think we’re going to have a lot of fun because we’ve already had an hour together. So where we’ve got it, I’ve got to chat it up on your own podcast on backslash eCommerce dash podcast, I’m going to have that in the notes for anyone that’s listening in the car if they want to get some more.

Matt Edmundson 2:04
Or just go to

Andrew Morgans 2:05
Okay, Thank you, I didn’t have those notes. So appreciate it. But now we had a lot of fun talking there. And you know, even talk some business afterwards, I think so, you know, it’s gonna be it’s gonna be a great connection. We were connected by someone great already. Yeah, I feel very close. So I’m just going to keep it real today with the questions. As like, my listeners know, I love getting into the founder story. I think that that’s something that kind of connects whoever’s on the show whether their guests the hero’s story, unless listeners and myself because this is honestly for me, I’m trying to get value. And by proxy, everyone else does. So, you know, I know you started a business. You know, I think I have notes here from 2004. Was that your first I guess attempt into into entrepreneurship. When did you know you were going to be an entrepreneur or a founder.

Matt Edmundson 3:01
I think I knew when I was a kid, you know. I remember when I was at school, I often say I started out life as a drug dealer. Because when I was at school, we we were we had this sort of these changing rooms where all the all the boys got changed and the girls got changed in the other one. And so you call it high school, we just call it senior school. And so I would have been probably what 13 At the time or something like that. And you’re

Andrew Morgans 3:26
our high school is is 616 1718

Matt Edmundson 3:31
Okay, in which case I’ve no idea what it is, but it’s, I was about sort of 1213 Okay, so and I was, uh, you kind of have to picture the scene, right? I have ginger hair. I have like yourself, right? I have national health glasses. Now. If you’re of a certain age in your English, you’ll know what that means basically means I had these government supplied glasses, which were really ugly. So I had these sort of national health glasses, ginger hair, and I used to get bullied quite a bit. And so one of the things that I did to become, you know, a bit more popular and not get bullied was I sort of tried to find my way in by selling stuff to these guys. They thought they were getting a bargain. I was making a bit of money on the site. And one of the things that I realized quite quickly that I could sell were my asthma pills. So I had asthma. When I was when I was younger. And the doctors gave me these tablets that I was supposed to take every day I didn’t need them every day but I suppose take them every day. These tablets though when you took them made you what made you pass wind you know through your backside that made you felt and so So I sold them as far as tablets and I’m because I didn’t pay for this medicine because we’re in England we have the National Health Service. I got all these meds this medicine for free. And then I’d sell it to the guys. Certainly all the boys in the class who would buy them and go around fine all afternoon and they were you know stoked about this. They’re loving it. Yeah, no, it was it was all mock up for me until I got caught by the teachers.

Andrew Morgans 5:05
But the double fighter flight that’s fight or flight, survival skills at that point yet why even you’ve got

Matt Edmundson 5:11
to do something right you got to do. And so that’s how it started. And when I left university, I didn’t really know what I wanted to do. Andrew, if I’m honest with you, I just, I was young, you know, I’d lived in the States for a while I’d, I traveled a little bit and some kind of like, I’d moved from my hometown to Liverpool. And I’m like, I don’t know what to do. I don’t know what career I just I know, I want to do something for myself.

Andrew Morgans 5:37
Can we pause right there for a second. So, okay, so you know, 1314, you’re in England, somewhere in there. And in college, when you say University, what’s that? Is that like, the next, like, seven, eight years.

Matt Edmundson 5:48
So I University over here is college fee, what you would call college, university. So it’s a degree

Andrew Morgans 5:55
we have, we have university and college, I think the difference is like the size, like if it’s a four year school or a two year school, just so you know. But so you did that in the US and then came back.

Matt Edmundson 6:07
I’m sorry, I did university here. I lived I before going to university. I don’t know how boring you want me to be. But I took some, I took some time out after my level. So we finished school when I was 18. We did what we call a levels. And I then moved to the states for about 18 months, and I work out and children’s home in North Carolina.

Andrew Morgans 6:28
So that’s what we do here everything. Like you know, a lot of our students will try to go to Europe for study abroad or something a year or two to kind of figure out what they’re doing. Okay, so I didn’t know that that even though we had the other way, I didn’t even know it went the other way. Yeah, no,

Matt Edmundson 6:41
I did. It was it was life changing is amazing. You know, you see the world is bigger than who you are. Which is a bit of a revelation when you’re eating so because the world normally revolves around you when you’re eating. And so, so yeah, when I left uni, I had and I wanted to go into business for myself, but I had an opportunity to go and work for a friend of mine who was a is an entrepreneur. And man, I totally respected and adored I thought he was fantastic. He was a great dad, he was a great husband. And he was running a successful business and he had ginger hair. I mean, you know, the the list of credentials just kept on growing with this fella. And so he immediately,

Andrew Morgans 7:21
exactly exactly like, I honestly, like I can relate to that apologist for a second, because what once was such a big insecurity is now you know, funny, and it’s popular now almost to be a gender, but very much. So. Where are you from? Like, I guess a lower income family to get like, at least here if we’re getting government aid, you know, kind of implies certain things. I don’t understand what the healthcare in Europe if that means the same thing. But you know, to have the government level classes, and did you come from like, I guess a business family or like, you know,

Matt Edmundson 7:53
yeah, my, it’s a bit of an odd one, really, it’s my parents divorced when I was a young kid when I was nine. So this is back in the 80s, where divorce was still quite uncommon back then. And so it’s a bit unusual growing up in a single parent family, and my mum was poor. When we were growing up, she worked several jobs, tried to maintain, you know, life, she’s probably one of the most people I respect most in the world is my mother and how she fought for a kid. My dad worked for himself, and then his company was bought out. And so he went to work for them. And so I saw my dad, as you know, he was he was kind of an entrepreneur, and then he was bought out by another company and worked for them. So I could see the difference in him. Actually, sometimes it’s good. Sometimes it’s not great for him.

Andrew Morgans 8:39
So you had a little bit of insight into like, doing your own thing, or the freedom that comes Yeah, or okay. Yeah, um,

Matt Edmundson 8:46
I was, I also had insight into growing up without stuff. But at the same time, my dad had stuff. It’s just that I rarely saw it. So hence resolved.

Andrew Morgans 8:54
You saw Dad have it you saw mom have nothing you’re like, Okay, there’s two worlds here. Yeah. So for me, just relating, you know, grew up missionary family in Africa. Oh, wow. So, you know, just till I was 16. I moved back from Congo at 16. Wow. So you that the whole of your childhood? Not the entire time. Actually, I just didn’t want to bore you either. But three, I was born in Montreal, my three I was in Cameroon. Then I lived in Moscow, and then Botswana. And then Congo. My name is I know, I know.

Matt Edmundson 9:32
They let you go back into the states when you’re 16 have to go into all those places.

Andrew Morgans 9:36
Honestly, it was after 911 It was December 25, 2001. And for the next 10 years, I was on a list and I got like first down and, you know, brought to another almost every time I flew for the next 10 years, so I won’t. But you can imagine being red hair, like coming back from Africa to public school. They don’t know what to do with You, you know, the kids don’t they’re like, the black kids don’t know what to do with you, but you feel more comfortable around them than anyone else. And then, and the white kids or country or little races, some of them or things like that, that I didn’t relate to, you know, I’m like, I don’t like that either. I’m cultured, I’m not like, you know, hillbilly. So you know, just getting picked on small glasses, you know, same thing, and you’re making friends with whoever will accept to keep you out of trouble. But I had a dad that had freedom in his life. So we didn’t have financial freedom, but geographically and like, you know, doing his own thing in Africa, right? We were pioneers there was not easing from organizations there. He stopped, he started it, he was the first one, you know, for a lot of a lot of those places. So seeing that then seeing coming to him, seeing him come back here at times, like later in life and work right for the man or a job look like it was killing him in some ways to have freedom like that. And then, you know, we weren’t, there wasn’t working remote and all these things that there are today, it was, you know, if you were living overseas and working or you were, you had to make a living there. So relating to you on that, just like where I think everyone has this, like an inspirational source were like, doing your own thing is like, you know, because there’s the amount of entrepreneurs that becomes not even just successful, the ones that are like, become entrepreneurs and support themselves through life. There’s very few of us. Number one, there’s a whole lot more than except just like, I’m just going to work the job. And that’s great for me. And so there’s usually somewhere where I think that like first light bulb, or that first Flame of like, I want to do my own thing comes from and for me, like I always just love doing a great job. I never saw myself as an entrepreneur, I didn’t see missionary work or mission work or that as being business at all. It was just the freedom aspect that I latched on to you know, so it was I wanted to be able to, to so you know, I didn’t even know the word entrepreneur till I was. I don’t know 2425.

Matt Edmundson 12:07
But it wasn’t fashionable, was it until a few years ago? Yeah. Same for you. But certainly here in the UK entrepreneur was seen as something that you would say if you were unemployed or couldn’t find a job. And I mean, it’s like, it was it was really cute. It was looked down upon a recently is this term been glorified? A

Andrew Morgans 12:24
little bit? Yeah. So for me, I think I just didn’t think of business. But I was always hustling. So you know, always had three or four hustles going on. Okay, so we’re back. You’re working for this guy, besides your mom, this guy that really inspired you? You know, like you still respect to this day. Let’s talk more about him. And what’s next?

Matt Edmundson 12:46
Yeah, so his name is Simon. And to this day, he and I are still good friends, he, I worked for him for five years. And he’s sold the business after that. And he, he moved from the UK to New Zealand where he still lives. And every year I try and go and see him because Zealand has a beautiful part of the world that you should definitely see at least once in your life. And yeah, for those five years, I kind of went from not knowing anything to watching this guy who was running a small business. And we were importing saunas and steam rooms from Germany. And so I had to learn how to do sales, how to how to do telesales, how to do health spa design and installation domain and, and we weren’t just selling saunas, you know, that you would buy for a couple of quid or you know, a few 1000 bucks, no, no, we were selling the most expensive sonar I ever sold was 120,000 pounds, which out about $160,000 Somewhere around there. For for, you know, a sort of seven, eight foot square wooden room is a lot of money. And so I just loved it, I absolutely got into it. We I love the job. I love what I was doing with you know, just meeting people and solving problems and understanding that this is how business works. And

Andrew Morgans 14:03
and to be honest, like aside, just a side perk or the side thought of that is like anyone you’re meeting that’s buying a sauna for $100,000 probably has a pretty cool origin story themselves, not everyone, right? But

Matt Edmundson 14:17
I cannot begin to tell you right what would happen was these guys would we would take them to Germany to see the factory to do the tour to go around health bars in Germany because the house was was so much better in Germany than in the UK. Certainly at the time. If you know, it was a we were so far behind the curve. It was ridiculous. And so we would go over to Germany. And so we would I would get to spend two-three days with these people when it Hellspawn. So the mobile phone doesn’t work. And if I’m honest with you, German health spas, they don’t wear clothes, right? And it’s just it’s just part of their culture. So you talk about getting to know someone you know, in a way that no one else has ever got to know them before and you’re that there, you’re talking about their origins, what they like. And I had people telling me stories about, I remember asking one guy, I’m not going to name drop, but I remember asking one guy, what was the worst impulse purchase you ever made? Because my wife was always going on at me for impulse purchases, you know, an impulse purchase, maybe, I don’t know, a CD or, you know,

Andrew Morgans 15:20
this body or something.

Matt Edmundson 15:23
Yeah. He, he’s, she is his wife just looked at him and said, Are you gonna tell him the story now? And so he just sort of put his head down as we sat there in the restaurant that night. And he said, he said, last week, I made a really bad impulse purchase. He said, I really liked black cars. And I was just, I just happened to be near the Ferrari showroom, and they had a black Ferrari in there. And he said, so I went and bought it. Just impulse purchase the Ferrari. And then he said, I drove it back to the house. And he said, I drove it around for a day too. And he said, I just didn’t like it. So I drove it back, sold it back to them lost 3040 grand or whatever it was, you know, selling this Ferrari back to me said, I’m an Aston Martin, man. Why did I do that? I don’t know. And so it was just different loads, German same problem, impulse purchase, just different magnitudes on what they couldn’t go and spend. So we had just the people and the stories. We have in the UK, something called the Times Top 10 Rich List, which every year the times, which is a newspaper here details who the top 10 richest people are. And at that point, when when I was taking people over to Germany, I knew quite a few of them. I had their cell phones on myself. That’s a good small business. If it was a main business, the VA was amazing. I would be on their private jets. I mean, I went and stayed in their ski chalets. I got to know some wonderful, wonderful people. Crazy things happen. Like there’s a lady who I got to know interior designer, beautiful lady. We just hit it off straight away. And we met in core Chevelle, which is in the Swiss Alps.

Andrew Morgans 16:59
Okay, big deal. Yeah, no, no big deal. Like the Alps, like

Matt Edmundson 17:05
Mainly, I’d flew, I’d gone to the Alps on the client’s private jet. I was staying in his ski chalet. He wanted a sauna, a steam room and a shower in his chalet. And, and so I went over to spec it out, speak to the builders and stuff and tell them what they needed to do. And that’s where I met this beautiful lady who was his interior designer. Fast forward a few years. She gets married, and we made a on that trip while we were together, we hit it off so well. And she said to me, she goes, Matt, listen, if I ever get married, I want you to do the wedding ceremony. And I was like, okay, all right, why not. And so a few years later, she calls me out of the blue, I’m getting married. And she got married in an Austrian Castle, which she had rented. And so my wife and I flew over to Austria, and I performed a wedding ceremony in an Austrian castle. And so I mean, there’s just lots of these stories, Andrew, I could wax lyrical all night. So I should probably

Andrew Morgans 18:01
I knew when you said that, like, there was a lot there that I was like, that’s the stuff that I would love. But for our listeners, we’re gonna keep it to the title and move along. Because I think people drive like for me, the most exciting thing is why I love this podcast. It’s why I love the industry, the eCommerce Industry, like I just love meeting people, you know, people are what make the world go around? In their stories, right? Everyone has one? Absolutely. You know, and a lot of times I find that people that are successful by you know, societal standards, for the most part successful have like the best stories, because usually the like, those people are made of a lot of struggle before they get there. And so you know, it makes for a good story. Getting back to your story. Okay, so you’re learning all these things. Five years with time, you’re still doing Simon, I believe you’re sorry.

Matt Edmundson 18:52
Yeah. What happened was just to bridge the gap. Simon sold a bit. I tried to buy it couldn’t buy it. couldn’t raise enough cash. He sold it to somebody else. I, in the meantime, built my internet business, went out on my own started doing websites and all that sort of stuff, which I’d been doing as a side hustle. And then about five years after he sold it. The company that we imported the saunas and steam rooms from Germany got back in touch with me and said, Would I get back involved? So this was when all the crazy things started to happen. And I was on clients private jets, because it was my company all of a sudden. So I was running an internet business, and, bizarrely, a health spa business and so so that was yeah, that was probably when did I leave the house? Bob? Isn’t I left that 2011. So yeah.

Andrew Morgans 19:11
So did you get back into it from the distributor that was making them or from the company that is like from the people that bought Simon’s business?

Matt Edmundson 19:45
So the people that bought Simon’s business, they had a license to import from the German manufacturer and to the UK. And after five years, the German manufacturer decided to end that relationship can the for reasons which I probably shouldn’t get into, but they decided to end that relationship. And they contacted me and said, Listen, would you be interested in getting back involved? And I said, So absolutely, I would. Yeah.

Andrew Morgans 20:09
So did you pick up a business that was pre existing, or you started another one then?

Matt Edmundson 20:13
So I started from scratch, but we had an existing customer base, okay. And the health bar industry is quite small. So I had a little bit of a name at that point still. And so we started, literally from scratch. But inside of a couple of years, we were, I mean, we were all steam.

Andrew Morgans 20:29
I mean, I know, I can attest that, like, even if I’m spending 10 grand or 20 grand, let’s say like, at least in my life, like, I definitely want to have a relationship with that vendor or that person. And it seems like, you know, you kind of get what you pay for and a lot of worlds, at least the ones I walk in. And yeah, I can see why that like, almost as you get a higher ticket item, those people get even more and more and more I want to work with like, who I know who I trust, you know, and they’re like, hey, we want Matt back kind of thing. Yeah. Okay. So I love that I just want to get into details. Like you didn’t inherit a business, you basically were starting from scratch with the customer lists or like, let’s get back in the game. And then you had an agency or consulting business building websites. Do they both? Were they both taking off where you’re scaling them? Was it just you what was happening though?

Matt Edmundson 21:17
Now there was me and my business partner at the time. And we we actually ended up doing two things. We we did the web agency, and we kind of merged an accounting idea. So we were doing accounting, and we were doing websites at the same time, which was quite good, because a lot of people at the time knew they needed an accountant, but very few people had websites. And so it was kind of an easy upsell. And then one of our website clients, a guy called Andy, I knew him from the house bar days, we ended up doing, you know, I ended up doing saunas and steam rooms from him. In fact, he was a guy that I spent several days within Germany get to know is a really interesting guy, South African guy. And he had a health club in Jersey, and he’s like, listen, I really need to do something with this health club. Now. Have you got any ideas? And I said, Well, man, you should, you should set up a website selling stuff online. Because at the time, bearing in mind, this is probably 2005. At the time, Jersey, which is a small island, off the off the coast of France is kind of between, it’s just a France, but it’s still kind of English. And it’s sort of independently British, if you’d like it’s it’s a strange thing, but it’s a tax haven. And so I said, you really need to start selling online because they had this quirky rule, which meant that they could sell goods to the UK without charging VAT, which is like a sales tax. But as sales tax is 20%. So if you can sell something for 20. Without that tax, you’re 20% cheaper. But you’re still making the same profit margin as someone from

Andrew Morgans 22:51
the past and to the customer and everybody else on price alone.

Matt Edmundson 22:55
And so that’s when 2006 We started Jersey Beauty Company and launched Jersey Beauty Company. I remember it really well. We launched it August 2006. And I thought, you know, just from the limited research we’ve done, I thought, You know what, if we can, if we could just do 10 grands worth of sales by the end of the year. So by the end of 2006, my plan was to have done 10,000 pounds worth of sales about $15,000. And I was like, if we could do that, that will be great. And we would be on track and it would be kind of the upper end of the research that I’d done. Well, by 2000, at the end of 2006, Jersey had not sold 10,000 pounds worth of product it sold 400,000 pounds worth of product. And that’s just when we knew we had struck, you know, like a gold mine is just like, you know that that picture that cartoon of a mosquito that hits someone’s blood vessel and and it’s just exploded and it’s like pull out pull out and it would just felt like that, like everything was just ballooning.

Andrew Morgans 23:57
What were you doing selling?

Matt Edmundson 23:59
Beauty products? Okay, so yeah, we took some well known skincare brands like Dermalogica Dino was another one. I don’t know if they’re in the states actually. It’s a French skincare ban super popular. And we started with just two skincare brands and we put them online and man alive. Did it take off? I mean, it properly went crazy.

Andrew Morgans 24:21
Is that how you met Jared?

Matt Edmundson 24:23
How did I know? That’s not how I met Jared. I was I was on somebody’s podcast and I’m really bad with names and it’s going to come back to me the name of

Andrew Morgans 24:33
really just thinking of like similarities between you know, skincare. Well, that’s

Matt Edmundson 24:38
what happened. I was on someone’s podcast, beautiful lady. She was a skincare therapist, and she was interviewing me about her, her podcast, beautiful, beautiful lady. And as I was telling my story, she’s like you need to meet Jared because you and him to sound so similar. And so she introduced us and then Jared and I connected and I’m like dude, you are like you’d like me in America. You’re like my memory. Can brother you know, just the stories was so similar? And so we met we hit it off really? Well we talk probably once a month at the moment. He’s a super cool guy. Yeah, I really like him.

Andrew Morgans 25:11
And you guys in the same space like building websites, you know, have at least like, you know, skincare by Alana as a beauty brand. I don’t know, we didn’t get to the end of this one. So okay, things are ballooning. I want to bring us back. But before we jump into the part two, let’s give another shout out to our sponsor Gusto. Yeah. Are you tired of long hours because of payroll, save more time with Gusto. With its automated processes, you can file taxes and manage payroll in a matter of minutes. What are you waiting for registered backslash Startup Hustle to get a free three months subscription now, that’s backslash Startup Hustle. For me, like it’s, it’s so important to get like so much of my stuff automated and like that’s a priority for me. And as well as being in the cloud, like I want to be in Liverpool, and filing like all of my payroll, getting everything done without having to worry about employees pre writing checks, or like having this ready and have my assistant have to drop it in the mail. So you know, great way to save, you know, I don’t have a full time bookkeeper, or I would say, like HR person at the time, and Marknology. I use like some fractional stuff. And Gusto really helps me plug that in. So shout out to Gusto for making this episode possible. All right, back to part two. So the the work you’re in, you’re building a website on the island of Jersey, which is news to me, I’m learning something new every day. And and from there, you guys are like expecting 15k in sales. Now listen, if an Amazon client came to me and was like, hey, Drew, like, I’m ready to get started, like, you know, we’re just shooting for 1500 a month in sales this year, if we ended the year with 15,000 in sales will be happy, that would be like, the easiest target for me to hit in the world. You know, just because I’m like, that’s, that’s a low like, that’s my own brand, I’d be pumped. Because I’d be building speed, but you’re shooting for that you hit 400,000 2006. I wasn’t in I wasn’t in the eCommerce game yet. Like, I was very familiar with websites and computers and all that, but I wasn’t doing Amazon or eCommerce. I can imagine that being good at it. Like you know, and having a value add or an opportunity like that would have been huge, like that tax thing. And one, kudos to you for being way ahead of the game. In regards to like understanding those types of strategies, like I remember in 2000 while I’ve been doing this 10 years, so like, let’s say 2012, And we were working like my first company was trailer hitches. And we had to be really clever with how we shipped trailer hitches. And it was actually in our negotiations with FedEx and UPS that we got these amazing rates on anything oversize, which allowed us to be even though we were late into the game, cheaper than every other distributor or reseller because the money we were saving and shipping. So now tax, you know, tax laws, all these things change with Nexus but you know, with eCommerce being the Wild West, if you’re clever enough not to find loopholes, but to find I would call them selling strategies, you can have an enormous success. Okay, so you have a spa business going on, you have consulting agency going on. Now you have an eCommerce brand that’s taking off almost as a half a million in its first year without trying. What’s next from there.

Matt Edmundson 28:31
So everything was growing. So Jersey was growing, the spa business was growing. We were I was, it’s interesting, when you get success like that. All of a sudden, people want to know how you do it. Right? And they and so then we were starting to get people contacting me saying, I need help with this, I need help with that. And the first person that said to me, I need help with my eCommerce business. I was like, I wonder if my ideas, my ideology here will translate to another business. And so I was like, Okay, well, we can do some coaching with you. And I didn’t charge them to do it. I was just like, I just wonder if it would work, you know, and, and so we started that out. And then the next slide the cable, the next person that came along, asked me the same question. I’m like, Well, sure, but I’m gonna charge you this. And the next person that came along, I doubled it and I just kept doubling that fee until someone went man that’s quite expensive. And that’s how I found my pricing for the for the coach. So that’s that subsequently that that whole coaching thing. Then it’s taken me all over the world. So not only do I get to run my own eCom businesses, but I get to travel the world helping other people with their eCom businesses, which is just awesome. It’s just magical. Honestly, I’ve seen so much of the world and and you get to understand the beauty of the planet and see different cultures and different ideas and you and you tree and does what you think work actually work in another country and what I’m what makes it is just, I love it the whole geology,

Andrew Morgans 30:14
I’m doing it now and I’m absolutely I’ve been I’m someone that would have probably been considered ADHD or like, you know, especially when you understand all of my upbringing and like, you know, eCommerce has been the only thing that’s captivated me where I haven’t been bored since since I found it. You know, and there’s just always something to learn. Now I’m doing international expansion and supply chain and trying to get more efficient and, you know, actually just got involved as a project with these Nigerian women that we’re going to, I’m going to, like build a business that’s giving back to them. And, you know, it’s just like, that’s, you know, I lived in Cameroon’s country over in you know, so it’s like, what are you going to get involved with don’t know, like, you know, I haven’t gone there yet to meet them. That’s my next question is, okay. So right now in the world of zoom, okay, this is in 2006, or 2008. You know, I have clients all over the world in Europe, we’re talking here in England right now. How do I get it where they’re starting to say, hey, I need you to see you in person come out, like, how does that work? How do I get them to bring me to Berlin?

Matt Edmundson 31:15
That’s a really interesting, I can only tell you what I did. And that was to get really good at what I was doing. Okay. And I think if you

Andrew Morgans 31:22
just say I need to be there in person, you just like make the ask.

Matt Edmundson 31:25
I think if I was if it was happening now, I think it might be different, because back then Zoom wasn’t really a thing. And the companies that I ended up working with and coaching with, I just say to them, Listen, I can talk to you over the phone. But let me tell you what will happen. If I come over and spend a week with you guys in person, and I get to, I want to go around your warehouse, I want to I want to pick and pack with the workers, I want to sit in your marketing department, I want to hear the guys on the customer service phone. I want to be able to take notes on everything and ask anybody in the company any question and get an answer, I need that sort of freedom to go around the business. There are very few people that will give it to you. But when you get it man alive, can you do some really great stuff because you’re a total outsider. And you, you see things I remember, again, he’s become a really good friend of mine, actually, one of my first clients in New Zealand, went over spent seven days with those guys, just deep diving in their business and their marketing director who was with who was walking around their business with me, she said to me at the end of sort of the end of day one, We’d only been there day one. She said, I have learned more about this company and the last few hours with you than I have the whole five years I’ve been working here. And you kind of go wow, wow, I in fact, I walked into the CEOs office. Day two, I’ll never forget, I walked into the CEOs office and I said to him, Listen, if I can, I reckon I can tell you a way where you’ll save a million bucks a year. But before I tell you what you can do to save that million bucks a year will you give me 20% of the saving? What do you say? He said, bugger off. So there’s no way but you can tell me what we need to do. So I was having a laugh and a joke with him. It was great.

Andrew Morgans 33:12
No, I love it. I’ve had I’ve had one instance like that, maybe verbalize and I can remember just how that made me feel. It wasn’t a paid client. It was actually at a local university here. I’m a mentor there. And I would speak in some like I was trying to become a speaker, I guess I am a speaker now. But at the time I was becoming a speaker and was getting practice at the class level. So you know, entrepreneurship, 201 or whatever, or design thinking and I had a student through his dad, his dad reached out to me as a business and he said my son said that your class or your like your lesson you’re speaking whatever he said was, was most impactful thing he’s ever heard in his four year career college or something, you know, now it’s just like, wow, I was just I was amazing. Speaking plane, I wasn’t even doing anything genius. You know, I was just like having a conversation with these kids. You know, not from a business perspective, but just knowing like, if you tell people what you’re really thinking and not afraid to ask questions, and like, you know, get into it. It’s amazing, like what that insight can do for people just to shoot straight. And I think in the business world, people are so scared of being wrong with the advice they’re giving, that they’re, you know, they don’t do anything at all, like I worked in that corporate environment, and there’s no incentive to stick your neck out. So for the lady that’s there, as the VP of marketing or whatever. You know, there’s frustrations or whatever of a company that size but usually it’s like, okay, if she suggests something crazy, it doesn’t work like that, that’s on her otherwise, she can just like keep maintaining. So I think it’d be awesome to come in as a business consultant. And I’m asking because I think there’s a part of me that sees my future in 10 years or whatever the case might be, where I’m either like, you know, some kind of investor or I’m buying businesses and and doing the same thing for them or, or coming in with a small team, probably and doing the same thing you’re doing. So just just you know, when you think about where do you go from here, sometimes I think continuing to business solve, problems continue to solve problems in business for for companies around the world would be like, a dream.

Matt Edmundson 35:19
It’s, it’s, it’s amazing. And the thing that I’ve noticed, Andrew, is that actually, when you go into somebody else’s company, when you do this kind of stuff, I say this to clients all the time, I’m gonna come in, we’re going to talk about stuff that is not rocket science, you could figure out everything that I’m going to tell you, right? I haven’t got a secret bullet, I haven’t got a secret source, the principles that we’re going to talk about, you could read in 24 different business books, right? The reality of it is I’m going to see it, whereas you currently don’t. Right? And, and that’s the reality of it. That’s the truth of it. Now, I know, for example, there are things in my business because I have become so tunnel-visioned in what we’re doing that I am not going to see it. And this is why why I think, you know, go do the coaching, go to the consultant because as you do it for somebody else, it makes you see your business in a different light. And you go man, I’m doing the same thing. I need to Jeremy and I need to change the mind. Yeah, I mean, I still don’t know, to this day, whenever I do coaching, or whenever I do consulting, I don’t know, to this day, who gets more out of it the client or me?

Andrew Morgans 36:28
Well, they always say teaching is the best form of learning. Yeah, you know, so it’s like, I can agree to that. And, you know, it is I always say it’s not rocket science, I’ve just spent 10 years obsessing about the common science, you know, on this platform, you know, it’s just like, it’s a methodology of just paying attention to the right things. And I think that, just like in relationships, you know, like, that’s why it’s so important to have like, the people around you be of quality, you know, you are the sum of the five people around you. Because what people can’t see in themselves you see in them, so if the five people around you are inspiring and motivated and disciplined, and like, have good character and all those kinds of things, you see it in them and you’re like, oh, I can do this for me, or, you know what I’m saying like it becomes a reflection or even they’re, they’re not so good qualities, those are a mirror to and you’re like, Okay, this is an amazing person that I highly respect, that’s a good character, whatever, and they they I see this flaw that’s something that like, you know, because you even have good people around you, you see good people with flaws and you’re like, Okay, that’s something that I want to address in my life you know, so I think that’s the same thing in business at least for me is you know your if you bring somebody in let’s say reputation, you’re bringing a good person into your company a good consultant Yeah, let’s say it’s even reputation you know, they’re coming in and they’re able to look like at your business and just see the things that you can’t just kind of like a fitness trainer or anything else and I didn’t understand that until I charged myself and I valued myself and the advice I was gonna give to others allowed it you know a lot more open mindset in my in my own mind to accept feedback from others and not consulting and be like oh my gosh, like so like last year or the year before the year before I had a speaking coach you know went through 12 lessons or so with him and God he ripped me apart like and I did a copy sales copywriting course you know, those are two like practical examples for anyone listing of things that I was like you know, there’s a lot of good things I’m good at sales copy is not it like you know, I can I can write good content but sales copy is not and speaking I wanted to be able to like get more direct with my points and just like get it out you know, which can be hard for me. Okay, so like, we have like 10 minutes I want I want to get to an i digress for going down a rabbit hole there but back to back to talking about consulting, and I was asking how do you get them to fly you out? Like because I think that’s that’s super cool. Like nowadays I get samples and we get a zoom call and talk about it. But it’d be so much you know, from logistics Amazon the Amazon ecosystem is like you know, you got supply chain pricing, competitor analysis profit, you have so many different aspects to any e commerce business, but specifically the Amazon one. Today’s title is like, you know, selling an E-commerce business, at what point so you have the Jersey business, you’re consulting for others. Where’s your first exit come into play?

Matt Edmundson 39:29
Jersey wasn’t my first exit. We sold various businesses over the years. Okay. But this was really the first I mean Jersey is what I was known for. So the other businesses that I sold nobody you pop them the people that bought them. They were they weren’t big out there business but because I’ve been doing e commerce podcasts because now we’re starting to get, you know, a little bit of exposure around the world and what I was doing. My name became synonymous with Jersey and Jersey became synonymous with me, Matt, the Jersey guy. And, and that. So Jersey is sort of the sale of almost part of identity in some respects to remain it’s that kind of. But it was, it was time to move on. We’ve been doing Jersey for 15 years. And I think we’d given it, you know, a good innings, the world of beauty was changing. And I just, I still get on really well with my business partner from Jersey, him and his wife, beautiful people, beautiful family. But it was, I think those kinds of relationships, they have a natural end and recognizing that endpoint and going actually, it’s probably good now if we do exit is really helpful. Yes. So. So yeah, we, we were approached at the start of 20 Euro now 22. So it’s 21. So the start of last year, we were approached by one of our competitors. And they said we’d love to buy Jersey. And I said, Well, awesome, because we’re thinking of selling it. So let’s have a conversation. And so we did and we reached a deal. And it took about about seven months for the whole thing to go through, which is both fast and slow at the same time. And so yeah, it was it was it was the right time, and it was a good thing to do. And I and it’s it’s freed me to do some whole other things now, which is great. But the problem is still misses it.

Andrew Morgans 41:33
Yeah, no doubt. And it’s something that I’ve had to contemplate, you know, the last couple of years, I think, since all the aggregators, and there’s offers going everywhere for e-commerce businesses or agencies, and who would I be, even during the pandemic, without offers on the table, you know, is one of these What if our client base can’t afford to pay us, you know, not saying they’re all go under, but what if they, they’re unable to pay, or they closed their doors, or stay on pause for 12 months, or all these scenarios when my head and I really had to do some, you know, internal searching just to make sure I wanted to be sure that I wouldn’t lose my identity. If for some reason I went, you know, I’m still going to be in business, I’m still going to figure things out. But if Marknology goes away, like who am I, you know, I wouldn’t say I’m synonymous with Amazon. But you know, if I’m known for something, it’s definitely that. And so, you know, if that’s taken away from me, you know, what, what do I do? And you know, I think there’s, I can find plenty of things to do, but I want to find something that I’m as passionate about, I wouldn’t be able to replace it with something not as passionate. Yeah. Okay, so, seven months? I don’t think that’s a super long time. You know, it’s not short. But you know, due diligence, and I just know that those things take time you’ve already sold other businesses? Do you have other eCommerce businesses you’re working with now that you’re trying to do the same thing? Or can we kind of speak to that vaguely like what eCommerce business compared to like some of the other exits.

Matt Edmundson 43:00
So it’s a funny thing, when you exit any an eCommerce or any business, I think when you exit a business, you have it, I especially if you’ve not done it, before you have this dream, don’t you every entrepreneurs dream is I want to build a business business, I want to exit at the right time. And so in your head, I’m gonna build it and I’m gonna sell it, I’m gonna get a chunk of money, which I’m going to be grateful for, I’m then going to sort of walk away into the sunset and, you know, go live in the Bahamas, or wherever, you know, wherever your your dream is. And the reality is very, very different. Very different. And so it’s, it’s, you know, if you if like you, you’re involved in the business in a way, which is more than name only, you know, your, your heart, your soul, your passion is going into this thing. You know, selling your business is like selling your kidneys. So it’s a bit bit more of a decision, you know, you’re not you’re not putting an old toaster on eBay and getting 20 bucks for this is quite a big deal. And so you’ve got to know that the time’s right. I mean, you’ve really got to know the times, right? Because the cost of selling the business is quite high. So there’s the emotional cost. But there’s the fact that a stranger is going to come poking around your business and ask you questions, which you’re not going to like. And you’re you almost feel like you’re defensive every day trying to justify things that you’ve done or not done.

Andrew Morgans 44:23
Why do I have to justify to use something that I built like, do you want it or not? Anything? Yeah.

Matt Edmundson 44:28
It and of course, you can understand it from the buyers point of view, they want to know what they’re buying, you know, it’s a lot it’s a chunk of change that they put in with so they they want to know there’s longevity in it for them and that they can make this thing work. So it’s quite right that they do this due diligence, but due diligence is not a pleasant process. No, it’s not, you know, you go to the doctors, you get a medical the outcome is good, you know, in terms of you want to go you want to get the results, the process. Yeah, you know, when he tells you to bend over, it’s not going to be pleasant, but it’s something you just need to do for a little while and so And so it’s a lot like that selling your business. There’s a lot of contracts to read, there’s a lot of admin work, there’s a lot of paperwork to go through. And I remember the first eCommerce business I sold back in 2002. Honestly, it was the easiest thing in the world, that I was buying a product from somebody I knew in the industry. And we were selling it and the guy that I was buying the product from just said to me, Well, Matt, can I buy the website from you? It’s successful. It’s got my products on there. And so it just means I can start the ball rolling from it. And I said, Sure. What, how much you willing to spend and we reached a price. I sent him an invoice and he paid me the invoice and I gave him everything. And it was just easy.

Andrew Morgans 45:40
Handed over. Was it an LLC? No, no, it

Matt Edmundson 45:43
was like six months. I was just like, Okay, you go Have at it sort of thing. It was, I think the amount we sold it for was like 50 grand, it wasn’t a lot of money, but it was it was

Andrew Morgans 45:53
maybe like 50 grand worth of work and do it and you know, you got

Matt Edmundson 45:57
Yeah, and it was easy. To be fair, I don’t think it was fifty. I can’t I genuinely can’t remember how much it was. But I think your jersey was a lot more involved. It was not like that at all. Not at all.

Andrew Morgans 46:09
You’re also selling to a competitor, which I was thinking having them poke around would be extra, you know,

Matt Edmundson 46:15
What if they don’t buy it, right? They’ve got access to you know, your methodology. They want to know what you’re doing your accounts that and there’s there’s a lot of trust that has to go on in the background as well. Lawyers have to get involved. And I mean, don’t my lawyer is a very good friend of mine. Another guy with ginger hair, love him to bits, right? Great, great guy, very capable lawyer,

Andrew Morgans 46:38
I need to move to England, I need to move back. I think you know, I’m 99.9 percent, you know, English, or at least European by 23andme. And I’m like, Man, my people are there. I think you know, there’s just I’ve already heard about three or four gingers. I’m sure I can make friends.

Matt Edmundson 46:56
I’m sure you could. My daughters are gingers as well.

Andrew Morgans 46:59
I’m like, Okay, anyone that can be bullied and have a sense of humor. I’m like, Alright, I like those.

Matt Edmundson 47:05
We do in England, we just laugh. That’s the best case.

Andrew Morgans 47:07
So so your lawyer is a redhead? Super trust them. And

Matt Edmundson 47:12
yeah, it’s still a pain in the ass. Right? And so. But that’s lawyers, that’s what they do. That’s what they’re supposed to do. And that, and that’s when you’ve got a good one, when you’ve got a bad one man alive, they can just suck the life out of the universe. And, and, you know,

Andrew Morgans 47:29
they’re literally the opposite of me. Like they think about risk. And like, you know, or like, all of those knows, and I’m like, I’m the complete opposite of you. There’s a reason we don’t get along. Well,

Matt Edmundson 47:38
yeah, exactly. It is I knew, but you’ve got to be comfortable with that, you know, they’re there to do a job. They, they, you know, they to be fair, they get a bad rap lawyers, I think, you know, they, they’re there to keep me out of jail and get me, you know, get me the money. At the end of the day modern. My friend, my lawyer did a great job, phenomenal guy. But it’s still, you still got to be mentally prepared for that, you know, you still gotta go right? This is like today, I’m working with another company. They’re an E-commerce agency. Sorry that I’m an E-commerce agency, they’re an E-commerce business, we we in effect, run their entire operation for them. Yep. They’ve outsourced the whole of the E-commerce to us with an with an intent to sell. So they want to sell their business in three to five years time. And so having gone through the whole thing with Jersey now, I’m already talking to Martin about the contracts that need to be in place so that when it comes to due diligence, the whole process is so much easier. But it still meant that today, I spent four hours going through draft number three, have quite a reasonably important contract, but do the work. Now, it’s a lot easier for the you know, when we come to sell it doesn’t.

Andrew Morgans 48:46
It’s that’s very time timing. When I’m struggling with words today, that’s very like timely, timely advice. Even in my own life. You know, we’re working with four brands right now that are planning to exit that I’ve been told, you know, they literally have hired us to exit, you know, in 18 to 24 months is kind of the timeline. There’s retainers, there’s profit sharing, there’s like, you know, brokerage fees for making the intros or basically we just agreed to if we hit these certain success goals, as we’re building the brand, that accent like if we hit this, we get this, if we hit this, we hit this and as an Amazon agency, I’ve never negotiated in a contract from the beginning of working with them a percentage upon exit. So that’s like, you know, it’s new stuff. For me, I’ve been a part of nine exits. So nine of the brands I’ve worked with in the past have exited. I wasn’t the one pulling the strings or in the back end or the back office for them. But I was the one that built the brand or built the website or build Amazon right. And there’s some we’re running the full ship. You know, like from three PL to social media to content creation to web to Amazon, even even here at Mark Knology, when we specialize in Amazon, so something very relevant to what I’m doing, you know, and it’s like, it comes down to at least, maybe you can like, correct me if I’m wrong, but really comes down to your contracts, you know, the longevity comes into like, Okay, well, do we have these vendors locked in for a couple of years that we have these partners locked in for a couple of these clients? And what’s your churn rate? You know, it comes to profitability, you know, and what those percentages look like. And then the team and like, you know, how sustainable at least as an agency or as an E-commerce team, okay, so who’s gonna run this after you’re gone? Or if it’s on an aggregator buying it, so you know, some of those things that I think can be translated across whatever business that is. But you’re right, like, if you’re planning for that, what are the ways you can get set up for success without having to do four or five before you learn, or, you know, before you finally learn, like, I’m not trying to learn on Marknology, I’ll be honest with you, like, that’s not the one I want to take that crash course on. You know, but I know that it’s near, it’s in the future. So these are things like very top of mind, for me, very top of mind, for the industry, a lot of Amazon sellers, it’s their baby, they’ve built it, it’s created freedom in their life, maybe got them out of their nine to five, and you know, now they’re being you know, offered 810 16x multiples, which is just an absolute crazy time. And you know, what, what’s crazy is, I know quite a few people that have exited. And, you know, when I’m talking to them, energy wise, I wouldn’t say necessarily what they say, but energy wise, and a bit of what they say. They almost always say it’s not like what they expected. And, you know, they say it was a tough, grueling process. And, you know, a lot of them, like hate the earnout part of it, I think, because they go from running their own ship to having someone kind of, you know, bossing them around, or, like, change so many things. And being a part of that, as it changes can be hard. And I just make note of that, you know, like, when you it’s almost like, if you been around someone and you never hear them brag about their job, or talk about their job that they love, you know, you’re like, I know that they don’t love their job, because if they did, we’d be hearing about it. So I think that’s interesting insight. And I would love for you just like, because I believe that, like, you know, the level of happiness that you have with anything a person and activity, exiting a business doing what you love, comes down to expectations, right? Like, that’s mainly it. Like, if you go to see a movie and you expect to be moving, it’s a B movie, you’re happy if you go expecting an A and it’s a B movie, like, it’s kind of like subpar acting, you know, and you’re not happy. So Eternals Yeah, see, there we go. There we go. Like if your expectation like if I go there, just like I’m gonna go watch a B movie action action. I know, she’s actually in the acting, it’s gonna be kind of shady. I’m like, Yeah, I got what I wanted out of it. I saw some awesome stuff blow up, you know. And I think that was so many people, like you have this goal of an accident, like maybe for years, maybe for a lifetime. And then like you said, you get there. And it’s like, not what you expected. And you’re left kind of just like empty. I would love to just wrap up the show, like, you know, with you, your thoughts on just mindset wise, besides just like the admin and lots of work and someone pushing in your business, like, what can founders prepare themselves for a book to read a podcast to follow, like, just just your your advice on what they can be doing? Besides hiring a consultant like you, I’ll leave that there, what could they be doing? To get themselves to get themselves, you know, better positioned mind wise, mindset wise, expectation wise, for those things.

Matt Edmundson 53:43
You know, when it comes to exit, there’s a number of things that you have to think about, besides your own soul, obviously, you’ve got to think about your end customer. So you know, the people buying Jersey, in effect, we’re buying that customer. And so I have to be able to, I have to make sure that that transition from from me to them, ultimately, the customer couldn’t lose out. Right. So I had to think about that ahead of time, and we had to plan for the customer.

Andrew Morgans 53:43
So there could be contracts.

Matt Edmundson 53:48
It could be contracts; it could just be making sure that the people by it really understand your customer domain and what the secret sources are and what makes them tick and why you do certain things, and the results of that. So you know that there are certain things that we did, and I went to great lengths to explain why we did them and the learning process that we had with Jersey and why our customers loved it because they’re going to want to see that carry on right? The second person you have to think about so you’ve got your customers think about you have to think about your staff, your team, because you cannot if you’ve got a team you cannot sell a business. If they’re demotivated, if they’re anxious, if they’re hurt. Whoever is coming in to buy it, are they getting the team? Are they? are they losing the whole team? What’s going to happen to the team? And for me, when we sold Jersey, this was probably the biggest question in my mind, I had to resolve because there was what 15 staff something like that Jersey, and I was like, I don’t, I don’t want 15 people to lose their jobs. And I just sit at home, you know, with a glass of cognac thinking, man, I’ve done well, surely, and

Andrew Morgans 55:28
gentlemen, and you’ve worked with those 15 people, 15 years, maybe not all of them, but

Matt Edmundson 55:32
They’re all friends, you know, and it’s, and you have to think about the scenario for them. I don’t necessarily have to take responsibility for absolutely everything, but I have to take responsibility for something and I have to think about them, and I have to get them excited, I have to get them on board with what’s going on. Because, you know, if they’re not on board, you’re gonna find selling your business, unbelievably hard and complicated. Like, I mean, it’s hard enough as it is, you know, get your team with you. Because otherwise, you know, you’ll find yourself alone one day, trying to do the work of nine people and allowing your company to sell it and you’re going to struggle. And it’s not, it’s not a great way to so my advice is this whenever you’re coming to exit whenever you’re going to end something, end it well. So your relationship with your customers end that well, your relationship with your staff end it well, your relationship with your suppliers. This was a lesson I learned when I when I exited the health bar business, I don’t think I ended the relationship with my suppliers particularly well at this point. And there’s, it’s been difficult to repair some of those good friendships as a result of my stupidity at that point in time, that was a really big lesson learned. So the suppliers who work with you, you know, the, some of our suppliers from the beauty brand, I part of me didn’t have a great relationship with them in the first place. But some of the brands I had a very good relationship with. And so how can I still stay friends with those guys? You know, how can I still go down to London, have a beer with them, or whatever it is that I’m doing, maintaining those relationships and ending those business relationships well, I think is crucial. Don’t burn the bridges.

Andrew Morgans 57:19
I love that. I love that. And I would echo that, like, another way of looking at it is just like, looking for the win win in all those areas. Like what’s a win for me and a win for my employees? What’s a win for me and a win for my customers? Are they getting a better team a more supportive team? You know, what are the what are the things I can sell them on? Yeah, I think that’s amazing. The last question I have, okay, because I can keep going forever. Because I’ve got people who don’t understand who I’ve got on as a guest today, like full of information. I think the last thing I would say is okay, so if you had to put them in an order of priority, okay. Is it the customers first? Is it your team?

Matt Edmundson 57:59
I think that would depend on what you’re going on to do. And so with the, with what I was going on to do, a lot of the team, we’re not, you know, the team weren’t going with the guy that bought Jersey, he was a competitor.

Andrew Morgans 58:13
He was gonna put his team in place.

Matt Edmundson 58:15
Yeah, he had his team and he, which is fair enough for him, you know, he’s got his methodology, he’s going to plug that in. So I had 15 people to then think about going forward. And so for me, it was key to get that team motivated to get them where I couldn’t give them the exact answers about the future, because I genuinely didn’t know. But I could be 100% honest about where I was at. But also mix that honesty with hope germane because just facts on its own can be a little bit painful sometimes. Yeah. And you know, what, Andrew, at the end of the process, I sit back and I look at the sale of Jersey and I and I, I would say it ended well, not because you know, of the sale because I drive around in the black Ferrari that my client sold back for 40 grand less. It’s not, I don’t actually drive around for everybody. But germane. It’s not because of what you would normally associate with success is because for me, I ended it well, because all of those guys still have work. And I’m still in a relationship. And actually quite a few of them still work for me. Some of them decided to move on, which was fine. They wanted to do something new. And the stuff that I’m now doing with that team. We are rocking and rolling man. I mean love is just everyone’s got this fresh vibe, we move warehouse. It’s a brand new start. There’s an energy we’ve not had for a few years. And it is just kicking off big time. And so I’m super stoked with that. And so I think to answer your question, what’s most important? It depends what you’re going to do afterwards. It really does depend and I think for me, it was the team.

Andrew Morgans 59:50
I loved that and dream world I would I would continue to build or improve or consult for businesses with with My core team, you know, I feel like I’ve built a world class team here, you know, it’s I’m just thinking through my own lens of you know what that could look like? And I think that’s important. No, no, what’s next. And it makes me think of the Four Agreements, the book, The Four Agreements, where it says, do everything with excellence, you know, it’s one of the things do everything. Even closing out your relationships, even ending things like in with excellence. And I can attest in some I’ve written emails, like 12 Different times where I felt like I needed that. The reason, you know, to explain to a client was letting them go, and let me give them all the reasons why and justify it and help help them for the next relationship that they’re going to have and the things that went wrong, or the reason why. And, you know, it’s only happened a couple of times. And I can say that in those times. I feel much better a piece with a short email I wrote that was kind. And that was just, you know, suggesting, sign the part ways. And you know, how can I serve you in this? On to the next chapter. There’s a huge part of me that wanted to write the 12 emails before, right? There’s just like, let me tell you why I’m right. You know, but at the end of the day, I think ending something with kindness and being cordial. And really, is the way that you know, I feel better about at night, and you know, on to the next chapter, when I hear them, I don’t think of resentment or bitterness or like anger, as we ended well, yeah.

Matt Edmundson 1:01:25
And that’s something but I mean, I can look back over my life, and I have a handful of relationships that have not ended well. And I regret every single one of them. And you, it’s easy to sit and go, it’s their fault. And this that neither of us can be. If I’m honest with myself, I just go I just, it’s just not right. And I part of me wishes I could go back and change some of those things. And some of it’s down to them. Some of it’s down to me and my pigheadedness or whatever it is, you know, in hindsight is a wonderful thing. But then there are things that I look back and go that ended really well. I wish I could do everything like that. germane and so that’s always my advice to people now and it will just end well. Don’t, don’t leave anything on a bad note. You know, just whenever possible end it well.

Andrew Morgans 1:02:11
Startup Hustle. I think that’s an awesome note. To end it on. Matt Edmondson, thank you so much for being on the show. And Gusto, thanks again for being our sponsor for today’s episode. Manage your HR needs with Gusto is the way to go make it easier to onboard talents, handle payroll and support your people in any way. Use those platforms powered by advanced technologies. So talent management and payroll processing will never be the same again, try Gusto for free, sign up with backslash Startup Hustle and enjoy a three month free subscription. Matt, I know it’s gonna be the last time loved being on your show. I could have picked your brain all day today. I think we have a few more businesses to get into the weeds of maybe we’ll have a part two and three. But I know it’s getting probably later there. Thanks again, listeners for listening. We’ll talk to you next time.