Ep. #964 - Software for A Better World

Matt Watson 00:00
And we’re back for another episode of the Startup Hustle. This is your host today, Matt Watson. And in today’s episode, we’re going to talk about how we can improve the AR world a little bit with Goodworld co-founder and CXO. Richie Kendall is here with us today. They can help companies improve their social impact and do good for the world. Excited to talk about how his company helps companies do that. Before we get started, today’s episode of Startup Hustle is powered by FullScale.io. Hiring software developers is difficult. Full Scale can help you build a software team quickly and affordably. And has the platform to help you manage that team. Visit FullScale.io to learn more. Well, Richie, welcome to the show. Excited about how we can all make the world a better place.

Richie Kendall 00:46
Glad to hear it. Great to be with you, man.

Matt Watson 00:49
So, you know, as we get started here, I love to first learn about your background. You know, I see here in my notes that you started the company in 2015. You know, kind of what led you to start this company, and how did you get here?

Richie Kendall 01:04
Yeah, I might rewind all the way back to my early days as a young creative person. I grew up with a knack for visual communication and storytelling and was taking on clients doing things like logo design and website in the early dot com days. And pretty quickly around, around the time I graduated high school, I had gotten quite a little list of like nonprofit clients. A lot of the work I was doing was pro-bono just to learn the skills and to help them out. I had about an eight-year film career after graduating from college. Writing, directing, producing, editing, and taking a lot of those skills and passions and transferring them over to the nonprofits that I was managing. So doing short films and websites for them. And after that film career ended up, I was getting airlifted into the tech world as a more hardcore, I would say, entrepreneur journey. And in 2015, I was tapped to build a next-generation philanthropy brand, a sort of mobile app for giving called Cheerful at the time. And it was through that journey that I learned all about what it takes to be an entrepreneur. And to kind of bootstrap up a business model; both the good and the bad. Since my company was acquired by the company I work for now, which is Goodworld. So in 2019, Goodworld acquired Cheerful, giving me a co-founder here.

Matt Watson 02:55
So what did Cheerful Giving do compared to what Goodworld does now? What was the key thing they acquired Cheerful for?

Richie Kendall 03:06
Yes, great question. Cheerful giving was the first mover technology to enable individuals to round up their everyday purchases for causes. Okay, short of acorns for giving. Okay, we found our business model back then, white labeling that technology for big nonprofit brands, like society, Amnesty International, and others. We were able to build a software-as-a-service business around that vertical and expanded the technology to include all-in-one fundraising tools. So your donation pages, your peer-to-peer fundraising, your event ticketing for nonprofits. And as we grew the technology stack, we grew the business. And by the time we came into the sights of Goodworld, we had a really lean and mighty growing technology stack and list of clients. And they were really interested in one providing an all-in-one suite of tools to some of their corporate clients like MasterCard and others. And so we were able to effectively transform our nonprofit impact suite into a full-blown Corporate Social Responsibility suite that now includes everything from loyalty and rewards, charitable gift cards, volunteering, and an impact CRM.

Matt Watson 04:39
And so that’s what goodwill does today.

Richie Kendall 04:43
Goodworld is an all-in-one social impact ecosystem for brands, influencers, and nonprofits to make the world a better place.

Matt Watson 04:49
So I mean, it sounds like what you’re doing is Cheerful. You are actually trying to solve several different problems, right, like making it so I can go to The grocery store and donate a few pennies, too, you know, the local children’s hospital is a totally different problem. And then some of the other things that you were talking about that you guys did, like, do you feel like you guys tried to do too many things?

Richie Kendall 05:16
Yeah, it’s a really, really important question, especially in the startup journey. And what we found was that while we had an ambitious long-term vision and passion for ultimately just reducing friction and creating a more seamless philanthropy experience for the next generation, we had to focus on beachheads in our business in order to grow it. And so it was really that core innovation, to begin with, that rounded up your everyday purchases, which provided a recurring revenue stream for our nonprofit partners that set us on the path to a sustainable and growing startup. If we had tried to solve other bigger, nastier problems at the time and lost focus on selling just that value prop, then I think we would have, we would have hindered ourselves. But because we used that as our point of entry into the market and then expanded the proposition outside of that. That’s what led to our growth.

Matt Watson 06:22
And so you could get that original use case, and then they were quick to do the other one. So that was, yeah, a go-to-market strategy. And that’s worked.

Richie Kendall 06:34
And a peculiar aspect of the nonprofit sector is, you know, they’re in a position where they’re typically a laggard adopter, meaning they’re not the first to grab onto the highest efficiency technologies, nor do they have the budgets to fully implement or optimize those strategies. So they’re ultimately looking for solutions that meet all of their needs simultaneously because the more platforms they have to take on, the more resource-constrained they get.

Matt Watson 07:10
So somewhere, is there a really famous scenario that maybe a bunch of us use your guys’ platform, like five years ago, we went to CVS, and we rounded up and gave money or whatever, and it went through your platform? I’m just kind of curious.

Richie Kendall 07:22
Well, I would say the most exciting use case now that you will see more and more is a technology we’ve kind of pioneered, which is based on a concept called quadratic funding. And it’s what we call the feature of giving cards. And the way gift cards work is that a brand or influencer can buy a batch of charitable gift cards, read them to an audience, and those recipients can then choose where the money goes. So more and more, we are working with major influencers and celebrity foundations on actually making charitable budgets and donations fully democratized, making a more inclusive type of impact.

Matt Watson 08:14
I felt like I’ve seen something like that before, where it’s like, Oh if you do this thing will give you a $20 Starbucks gift card or this type of gift card that you can use to give to various charities somehow. That’s exactly right. Yeah, it seems like I’ve seen something like that before. Yep. I don’t know if it was you guys or not. But going into this, did you feel like creating tech, like you have to create a lot of technology to help do this? What was it like creating technology for nonprofits? Like, was that difficult to monetize? Like, did they have money that, you know, to spend on this where you guys could make money? Or where did you guys have to run extremely lean and mean and almost feel like a nonprofit yourself to be able to do this for them?

Richie Kendall 09:02
Yeah, it was certainly the ladder. I think when, when you’re a first-time entrepreneur, you come into any new space with maybe a lot of passion but certainly a lot of naivete. And we learned early that it would be quite easy for us to take on all of the problems of the industry and bury ourselves in those issues. So I would say that the nonprofit industry is kind of a unique beast, if I might use that term, in that they make decisions a certain way. They take a certain amount of time to plan and execute those decisions, but they’re like any other organization in that they have the budget, budgetary planning processes, and decision-making processes. So you just have to get into the cadence and rhythms of those time frames to become an effective vendor in the space.

Matt Watson 10:01
Do you feel like working in this space also helped you with recruiting your team and hiring and stuff? Because you have some people that naturally like, Hey, I love the idea of helping nonprofits.

Richie Kendall 10:11
Yes, I think more and more, the purpose economy is emerging. And that economy is drawing people kind of outside of the strictly for-profit incentive structure into their passions, and I think a deeper sense of purpose or why they’re here and, and what they want to contribute while they’re here. So we’ve never had a problem sort of putting out that beacon and attracting passionate talent.

Matt Watson 10:42
So you described it earlier. CSR was kind of the acronym you were thrown around. What was CSR? Again, what did that stand for?

Richie Kendall 10:52
Yeah, CSR stands for corporate social responsibility. And there’s another quite popular acronym called environment, social governance. And these are the sort of criteria that large companies and even smaller organizations should be thinking about in the next iteration of their organizations. So it’s a full stakeholder approach rather than just a profit-first approach.

Matt Watson 11:22
How long do you think, you know, this sort of corporate social responsibility? Don’t know if I would call it a trend? Or, or what have you? How long do you think that has been more of a common thing than just like over the last five years, 10 years, 20 years? And it’s like, slowly kind of building? What curious take on that?

Richie Kendall 11:45
Yeah, that’s a great question. Because it’s steeped in a long history. This is not just a new trend, philanthropy and corporate philanthropy goes back to, you know, the middle of the 20th century with, you know, the Rockefellers and your major companies that put aside a percentage of their overall revenue or made sweeping sort of grant infrastructure available to nonprofits around the country. But it isn’t until the last 20 to 30 years that companies have really taken on CSR as a part of their operating principles. And it probably isn’t until the last, I would say, even 10 years that the or maybe even five years that the ESG acronym has really come onto the scene ESG being the kind of sustainability mandate that all enterprises should be thinking about in creating more sustainable businesses, reducing carbon, their footprint, reducing waste, consolidating their supply chains, buying local, you know, bringing D AI principles into their vendor, their their vendor outsourcing. So all of these things come together. And I think, ultimately, the CSR moniker is a long term trajectory. It’s not a trend, it’s something that all businesses moving forward will be building into their, their, their futures.

Matt Watson 13:19
Do you see it? In primarily companies that are over a certain size? If somebody has two employees like this is probably not a priority for them? Right. But is there a certain size of a company that this becomes more of a part of their culture?

Richie Kendall 13:34
There are a couple ways to look at that question. You know, I think you have startup founders that want social impact baked into their mission from the get go. And whether they are two employees or 10 employees, that Social Impact mission can be a part of their operations. Now, it’s true, that isn’t what you would consider an enterprise CSR program. And an enterprise CSR program is typically for companies with let’s say, you know, 200 or more employees, whereby they can run sweeping programs like payroll giving, did you lose me there, Matt? For a minute?

Matt Watson 14:18
I did, but it sounds like I’ll just keep going.

Richie Kendall 14:21
It’s okay. So I was just saying that depending it could be, it could be a startup with two people. It could be a startup with 10 people. Those founders will often bake social impact into their mission that is different from a 200 person or 5000 person enterprise Corporate Social Responsibility platform or program. But I think the intent is the same, that there’s a social mission underneath the organization and they’ll get creative in how they create positive externalities with their business.

Matt Watson 14:59
So give us some examples of what those social responsibility type events or causes would be like, what will give us some examples of that?

Richie Kendall 15:08
Yeah, yeah, one, one example. And maybe the mid mid-market would be where a company that is looking to incentivize customer reviews on review sites, maybe like you said they want, they want people to leave a review. So they incentivize people leaving review by offering them an Amazon gift card, or $25, to the charity of their choice. That’s just one example. And a broader example would be where maybe a large company wants to solicit their employees to deduct a little bit of every paycheck towards causes in their local communities. And in those examples, workforces can generate 10s of 1000s, hundreds of 1000s, even millions of dollars, year over year for important community organizations. Other programs include gift matching, where when someone donates to a charity, the company will match that donation up to a certain amount, or, or even this, this idea that if I volunteer a certain amount of hours for a local organization, that the company will donate a certain amount of money to that organization. So it’s a virtuous cycle of community development.

Matt Watson 16:28
Yeah, one, one company, I was very familiar with here in Kansas City, they were really, really big into this, and it was coming to call balance point. They, I think, maybe changed her name, or I don’t even remember anymore. But they were really big into this. And it was like, I want to say it was like once a month, even they allowed all their employees to spend the day on whatever kind of charity they wanted, if it was, you know, Habitat for Humanity, or whatever it was that they wanted to do. And they were really, really big into it, which was actually the first time I’d ever seen a company that was that big into it. From my, you know, experience. But it was like a huge part of their culture. And I was always impressed by it.

Richie Kendall 17:11
We love companies like that. And we believe that they are leaders in space and represent the future of the economy. Just to riff on your points there. 83% of millennials report higher loyalty to companies that help them support social issues, and 17% higher productivity is reported by businesses who engage their employees in these types of initiatives, and increases passion, motivation, cohesion, culture at work, and ultimately creates just a more enduring brand infrastructure.

Matt Watson 17:54
Well, we recently just did some really cool stuff at Full Scale I want to tell you about. But before we do that, I do want to remind you that finding expert software developers doesn’t have to be difficult, especially when you visit FullScale.io where you can build a software team quickly and affordably. Use the Full Scale platform to define your technical needs. And then see what developers QA and leaders are available to join your team visit FullScale.io to learn more. I think it was two weeks ago now. So we have almost 300 employees in the Philippines at Full Scale. They do software development, and QA and other stuff. And we did it the whole day. And I think everybody took the day off on a Friday and they did all sorts of really cool charity work are all across the Philippines in their different cities like so someday they we donated some solar panels, some people cleaned up a beach, some people planted some trees and there was like all these different activities they did and I was really blown away by the amazing work that our team did, and glad that we can help sponsor that and help them do that. And so yes, it was one of the things that we’ve done in this, you know, corporate giving back, you know, charity kind of thing, so glad we were able to support and do that.

Richie Kendall 19:14
Yeah, it’s awesome. I mean, we spend two thirds of our waking life in the workplace, you know, why not every once in a while take some time to give back to communities or to the communities around us and share experiences that have a higher sense of meaning and belonging sometimes.

Matt Watson 19:38
So tell me more about Goodworld now and what you guys do like kind of who is your who is your target business that would sign up and use this and what are like some of the reasons they would sign up for like you mentioned earlier some a lot of different scenarios where people do this kind of stuff, but like what give us the pitch you know why? Why should somebody sign up for Goodworld now?

Richie Kendall 20:02
Yeah, well, I might point out, we work with hundreds of companies, we power MasterCards global donations platform, we work with 1000s of nonprofits helping fuel their missions. And, you know, I think the core reason you may want to consider working with Goodworld is, is one to drive the future of the purpose economy. We just, we believe strongly that the next generation consumer is looking for brands and companies to support with their dollars that are not just making quality products and offering high quality services, but are also stewarding a better world at the intersection of so many crises. So we think it is quite important to keep your eye on the prize in your heart. But from a purely sort of self serving point of view, companies who engage in these types of programs are just dramatically more effective organizations and have soaring EBIT TAs are growing their bottom lines at much higher rates than companies who ignore CSR and ESG imperatives. So if growth is your bottom line, it’s not it’s not a, it’s not a charitable, it’s not just a charitable thing. It’s actually mutually beneficial to engage in this type of work.

Matt Watson 21:31
So tell me more like if I went to our CEO and our HR department and said, Hey, we need to sign up for this thing. And this is what they’re going to do. Like, don’t give me a little more of a tactical breakdown, like, hey, we can allow people to donate part of their paycheck or like we can do company matching, or like, what are some of the tactical things that this would enable us to do?

Richie Kendall 21:51
For sure, yeah, so the first thing is, you know, you may want to establish a company policy that, let’s say, matches donations up to a certain amount from your employees, that will dramatically increase employee engagement in the workplace, because they’re going to feel that their employer is investing in their values. So that just deepens the bond. It also creates a heck of an impact, you know, to x impact on all of these donations. So workplace giving is a big one volunteering, if you if you want to offer a curated list of remote friendly volunteer experiences to your employees, that you can incentivize in different ways to enrich their experience, that is also a part of what we do, you could take a portion of your of your budgets or a portion of your revenue or profits, and commit that to to giving to your employees for charitable causes. So for example, you know, if you want to say 1% of overall profits will go to charitable causes, instead of just writing a check at the end of the year, why not give that money to your employees in small increments through a variety of creative programming that becomes meaningful throughout the year. So maybe on a birthday, you give someone 25 bucks to send to the local animal shelter of their choice, or when they hit a work milestone, support them with some charitable money that they can support a cause that they care about. Lots of different ways to incorporate these tools into your culture. Happy to keep going.

Matt Watson 23:33
But there was one thing you mentioned that I think I’ve always struggled with. So it’s one thing to donate money, right, it’s another thing to donate your time. And I feel like I’m a little more out there, donate my time, if I can. And definitely if you work remotely, that might be more of a challenge. And so you mentioned something about that earlier. So I’d love to hear more about donating your time and volunteering, you know, something like Habitat for Humanity or something like that as an example. But, you know, do you guys provide a curated list of like ideas, because I figured I feel like that would be the struggle. I go to all our employees and say, hey, go volunteer, and you’re like, Well, we’re What do I do? You know?

Richie Kendall 24:11
Yeah, totally. We do provide a list of like a handful of remote friendly volunteer opportunities that are often skills based, but often hard skills learned. So for example, you could create a poster or transcribe an audiobook for someone who can’t, can’t see. You could teach people who need to learn about audio visual technology about how to do it. You could teach people coding skills in third world countries, anything that you’re learning in your career. You could teach to someone who doesn’t have the same opportunity and all that can be done remotely now. So those are some really powerful skills based volunteer opportunities that often provide some of the most meaningful experiences people ever have at work.

Matt Watson 25:11
Very cool. So, yeah, sorry to interrupt you earlier. Yeah, tell me more Tom Thomas, I want to go to the HR department, I’m like, Hey, we, we need to do this. So tell them to tell me some more reasons.

Richie Kendall 25:24
Yeah. Other reasons might be that you want to get employees together for let’s say, lunch and learn. You, you want to encourage employees to participate in some kind of morale building experiences. Anytime you’re trying to build a better culture and accompany adding a charitable component amplifies the effect. So for example, if you want to encourage people to take part in a social outing, anyone who goes reward them with with a with charitable impact points, you could put together like a social impact screening of some kind, where you watch if you will all watch a film together on a cultural topic that challenges the mind and the heart in in areas that can sometimes be uncomfortable, but do create dynamic conversations around identity, intimacy, diversity, equity, and inclusion. All of these conversations are incredibly important. And it’s the organizations who summit sort of dive headfirst into them and create a sense of under-creation in an enriching culture is an imperative for organizations these days, and there’s nothing like social impact to do that. One example would be, you know, a lunch and learn where individual employees are encouraged to learn about causes in the area. Anyone who attends a lunch and learns or a seminar could get rewarded with some impact points to make a difference. Another example might be put on a short film screening, where individuals from the company can have a moderated discussion about important issues like diversity, equity, inclusion, identity, inequality, things, things that are challenging social topics, but that help us all grow together, especially in the workplace. So you can encourage these types of dialogues by offering incentives and building these sorts of morale Building Cultural cohesion mechanisms, right into the, into the workplace itself.

Matt Watson 27:44
So I have a question for you. So I’ll be honest, I’m not necessarily the biggest person when it comes to charity, just never been a big charity person. And especially when it comes to work. I’m like, I want to go to work. I want a lot of work done. And I don’t want to leave. And the last thing I want to talk about at work is politics, or, honestly, a lot of this stuff, right? It’s like I want to go to work or do work. And social responsibility has not necessarily been as big of a focus for me in the past. And so what kind of advice would you give to somebody like me about how to do a better job at this going forward? What kind of advice like we’re, where do I start?

Richie Kendall 28:23
Yeah, I think the starting point is patience and listening. Because, you know, I like you. It’s easy for me to just put my head down and get my work done and go home at the end of the day. It’s not that easy for everybody from every background. There are systemic issues in how we promote leaders in how we address certain topics in how some people with minority identities get placed or, or how they get brought into conversations and how they’re able to collaborate. And so I think these conversations are important, if not, if not something that should be put in the forefront of the business, but certainly something that should be there should be an open dialogue around these issues. And it’s, it’s a lot of the reason that employee resource groups have become very popular within organizations to keep cultures dynamic, to keep cultures humane, and to keep cultures compassionate.

Matt Watson 29:39
Well, and I would say, even though I haven’t necessarily been the biggest person that would think about this kind of stuff. I feel like I’ve, I’ve always acknowledged that there are other people that do and the best thing I can do is support them, you know, and it’s like, maybe this isn’t something that’s really super top of mind to me, and maybe I’m not as passionate about it, and maybe that’s okay. But there are other people who are and the most important thing I can do is try to support them. And, you know, make sure to allow them to be able to spend the time to do it. Like even if I don’t want to spend my time on it, making sure that I tell them, It’s okay that they can spend their time on it, if that makes sense.

Richie Kendall 30:17
That’s a beautiful ethic, if we, if we ran the world, that way, you know, the world would run much smoother. It, you know, this sort of live and let live is a beautiful philosophy, and we should all be here supporting one another. We never know what challenges each other are facing and, and whether it’s within the workforce or outside the workplace in hard hit communities that have maybe been struck by natural disasters or, or entire countries that have been invaded. unprovoked, we do need to have that social solidarity. And that sense of we’re all a human family. And when we are caught in hard times, if our neighbors come to help, we can, we can be better. And I think that at the end of the day, this corporate social responsibility, corporate philanthropy, it’s all really just bringing our humanity into the way we organize ourselves, because business is at the heart of what we do.

Matt Watson 31:23
At the end of the day, we can, you know, we don’t have to mandate that our employees do this stuff, right? We’re not like, you have to go clean the beach this weekend. But we’re like, Hey, if you guys want to do it, we’re supporting it, we can help fund it, we can, you know, we can encourage people to do it, we can encourage team building, and ultimately, that’s all we can do, right? Like, we can try and do good, we can try to, you know, throw some dollars at some of it to motivate them to help fund you know, it doesn’t take a lot of funding like hey, well buy everybody lunch, you guys go clean the beach or whatever, right? Well, we’ll pay for transportation to get there, whatever, we’ll rent a bus, whatever we need to do. And but you know, and, and I think the biggest thing here is like, it’s not necessarily been my biggest personal thing, it’s not my personality, right. And that’s what’s interesting about humans is we are all very different, and have different personalities, my wife is totally different. My wife will come to me all the time, like, Hey, I think we need to go buy flowers for so and so. And I’m like, never in a million years did I think to buy flowers for this person. But my wife thinks that way. And you know what, I have to embrace them. Like, you’re right, that’s a great idea.

Richie Kendall 32:29
And I’m glad you think that way, because I just don’t, ya know, I couldn’t agree more, we’re a big bouquet. This human family and by supporting one another and honoring and appreciating the differences, it makes us all stronger. So I’m glad to hear you say that man.

Matt Watson 32:45
So I think that’s the thing is like, you know, if you’re listening to this, and you’re thinking, You know what, I love this, but it’s not necessarily some I’m gonna put all my energy into it’s like, at least allowing somebody else to write if there are people that want to do this, it’s support them, right? Like, support your employees, put a few dollars behind it, and let the people that are really passionate about it, let him do it. Let him go do it.

Richie Kendall 33:06
Yeah. And you may even be surprised when you do push yourself outside your comfort zone. And you attend, you attend an event where there’s some kind of charitable component to it, or you go out to help feed some folks or train some someone in the skills you’ve learned, you often find that it that you find a deep sense of meaning in that experience, and that you learn more about yourself than you otherwise would.

Matt Watson 33:37
Well, I think you bring up a really good point, you know, I am the kind of person that would really enjoy going with the team to go clean up the beach or do whatever. Like, I think I mentioned earlier, like, I’d rather donate my time, like I actually enjoy those kinds of experiences. And I love those team building opportunities, especially if it involves getting to spend more time with the team. So I love that I do.

Richie Kendall 34:01
Yeah, and that’s, and that’s why these types of things are becoming increasingly popular. And, you know, there are circumstances where we can’t give our time, you know, in the wake of the Ukraine crisis, no one could go in there, you know, there’s not much anyone can do. And so when you feel helpless, and you and you have a few extra dollars to give, it’s those dollars that make all the difference for families on the ground who have lost everything. So yeah, depending on where you are or how you’re feeling, any gift you can give, time or otherwise, makes all the difference.

Matt Watson 34:40
Well, yeah, I was very proud of what the Full Scale team did. And I hope that’s something that we can continue to do every quarter or something like that. Definitely every year, so, you know, if you do need to hire software developers, Full Scale can help. We have the people and the platform to help you build and manage a team of experts when you visit FullScale.io. All you need to do is answer a few questions on our platform to match you up with our fully vetted, highly experienced team of software engineers, testers, and leaders. At Full Scale, we specialize in building long-term teams that work only for you. Learn more when you visit FullScale.io. So, Richie, what do you see is the future for Goodworld now and, you know, continuing on this mission.

Richie Kendall 35:21
We see a future where social good is baked into everyday business operations. So whenever a sale is made, whenever value exchanges hands, at least a small part of that is going to a pro-social future. And to help untangle challenges and problems that affect our communities all around us. So we just believe in compassionate capitalism. One that, yes, is focused on growth and efficiency, and productivity. But that also creates a better world for everybody.

Matt Watson 36:03
Well, I love that idea. As a business owner, if you don’t think as an executive, right? If we could leverage something like Goodworld to make it easy. It’s like, hey, you know what, we were able to leverage their platform and integrate it into, you know, our HR and our employees. And if this is something our employees want to help with, do we make it easy? We made it easy for us to do this, right? Instead of like, I don’t even know where to start, right? Like, how would we do this? How would we make donations like all that? Like, I wouldn’t even know where to start. So if you guys make it easy, and it makes it easy to implement, and you know, from a corporate structure, we can decide how much money we want to put into it. But we also are enabled to make it really easy for our employees to donate through payroll deductions or all these different things. Like me, that’s awesome. That’s a win-win for the world.

Richie Kendall 36:52
Yeah, that’s why we exist. And we’re here to work with those companies that are prepared to make those commitments. And kind of keep their eye on their higher purpose.

Matt Watson 37:01
That’s awesome. Well, thank you so much for doing that. Thank you so much for building that and making way for us to donate and give back. So thank you so much.

Richie Kendall 37:10
No, thanks. It was a great interview. Matt, I look forward to talking again soon.

Matt Watson 37:14
Thank you, sir.

Richie Kendall 37:15
All right. Have a good one.